If I had time I would share with you an excerpt from a book I read last year but am pressed for time. Perhaps I can make it back here tomorrow and share.
Perhaps you've read Raymond Fowler's book, The Watchers II? If you did then I am sure you did not miss page 192 and 193 about The Protevangelion.
It absolutely makes clear that Mary and Joseph were both being helped and guided by extraterrestrials in preparation for the birth of Jesus. It is an account that I had never heard of other than in modern UFO/Contactee experiences.
If you would like I could share The Protevangelion 2-14 with you if you've not read the book.
I have not read that book Jamie and would be interested to see what it says.
I'm not too sure what inspired me to write about this. The gospel account is extremely curious in its own right. Evidently the artists who made the two paintings and the fresco had their own sources of inspiration or knowledge. I did find it humourous how forward the angel Gabriel was with Mary, and how unfamiliar or insensitive or...alien he was to how Mary might respond to his shocking fiat. I mean, you certainly couldn't call it a proposal.
I would love to see the pages you reference, perhaps you could send me a link to a source? Thank you!
1 Joseph seeks a Hebrew midwife, 2 perceives the fowls stopping in their flight, 3 the working people at their food not moving, 8 the sheep standing still, 9 the shepherd fixed and immoveable, 10 and kids with their mouths touching the water but not drinking.
AND leaving her and his sons in the cave, Joseph went forth to seek a Hebrew midwife in the village of Bethlehem.
2 But as I was going (said Joseph) I looked up into the air, and I saw the clouds astonished, and the fowls of the air stopping in the midst of their flight.
3 And I looked down towards the earth, and saw a table spread, and working people sitting around it, but their hands were upon the table, and they did not move to eat.
4 They who had meat in their mouths did not eat.
5 They who lifted their hands up to their heads did not draw them back:
6 And they who lifted them up to their mouths did not put anything in;
7 But all their faces were fixed upwards.
8 And I beheld the sheep dispersed, and yet the sheep stood still.
9 And the shepherd lifted up his hand to smite them, and his hand continued up.
10. And I looked unto a river, and saw the kids with their mouths close to the water, and touching it, but they did not drink.
CHAP. XIV.
1 Joseph finds a midwife. 10 A bright cloud overshadows the care. 11 A great light in the cave, gradually increases until the infant is born. 13 The midwife goes out, and tells Salome that she has seen a virgin bring forth. 17 Salome doubts it. 20 her hand withers, 22 she supplicates the Lord, 28 is cured, 30 but warned not to declare what she had seen.
THEN I beheld a woman coming down from the mountains, and she said to me, Where art thou going, O man?
2 And I said to her, I go to inquire for a Hebrew midwife.
3 She replied to me, Where is the woman that is to be delivered?
4 And I answered, In the cave, and she is betrothed to me.
5 Then said the midwife, Is she not thy wife?
6 Joseph answered, It is Mary, who was educated in the Holy of Holies, in the house of the Lord, and she fell to my lot, and is not my wife, but has conceived by the Holy Ghost.
7 The midwife said, Is this true?
8 He answered, Come and see.
9 And the midwife went along with him, and stood in the cave.
10 Then a bright cloud overshadowed the cave, and the midwife
p. 34
said, This day my soul is magnified, for mine eyes have seen surprising things, and salvation is brought forth to Israel.
11 But on a sudden the cloud became a great light in the cave, so that their eyes could not bear it.
12 But the light gradually decreased, until the infant appeared, and sucked the breast of his mother Mary.
13 Then the midwife cried out, and said, How glorious a day is this, wherein mine eyes have seen this extraordinary sight!
14 And the midwife went out from the cave, and Salome met her.
15 And the midwife said to her, Salome, Salome, I will tell you a most surprising thing which I saw,
16 A virgin hath brought forth, which is a thing contrary to nature.
17 To which Salome replied, As the Lord my God liveth, unless I receive particular proof of this matter, I will not believe that a virgin hath brought forth.
18 ¶ Then Salome went in, and the midwife said, Mary, shew thyself, for a great controversy is risen concerning thee.
19 And Salome received satisfaction.
20 But her hand was withered, and she groaned bitterly.
21 And said, Woe to me, because of mine iniquity; for I have tempted the living God, and my hand is ready to drop off.
22 Then Salome made her supplication to the Lord, and said, O God of my fathers, remember me, for I am of the seed of Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob.
23 Make me not a reproach among the children of Israel, but restore me sound to my parents.
24 For thou well knowest, O Lord, that I have performed many offices of charity in thy name, and have received my reward from thee.
25 Upon this an angel of the Lord stood by Salome, and said, The Lord God hath heard thy prayer, reach forth thy hand to the child, and carry him, and by that means thou shalt be restored.
26 Salome, filled with exceeding joy, went to the child, and said, I will touch him:
27 And she purposed to worship him, for she said, This is a great king which is born in Israel.
28 And straightway Salome was cured.
29 Then the midwife went out of the cave, being approved by God.
30 And lo! a voice came to Salome, Declare not the strange things which thou hast seen, till the child shall come to Jerusalem.
31 So Salome also departed, approved by God.
CHAP. XV.
1 Wise men come from the east. 3. Herod alarmed; 8 desires them if they find the child, to bring him word. 10 They visit the cave, and offer the child their treasure, 11 and being warned in a dream, do not return to Herod, but go home another way.
THEN Joseph was preparing to go away, because there arose a great disorder in Bethlehem by the coming of 1 some wise men from the east,
p. 35
2 Who said, Where is the king of the Jews born? For we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him.
3 When Herod heard this, he was exceedingly troubled, and sent messengers to the wise men, and to the priests, and inquired of them in the town-hall,
4 And said unto them, Where have you it written concerning Christ the king, or where should he be born?
5 Then they say unto him, In Bethlehem of Judæa; for thus it is written: And thou Bethlehem in the land of Judah, art not the least among the princes of Judah, for out of thee shall come a ruler, who shall rule my people Israel.
6 And having sent away the chief priests, he inquired of the men in the town-hall, and said unto them, What sign was it ye saw concerning the king that is born?
7 They answered him, We saw an extraordinary large star shining among the stars of heaven, and so out-shined all the other stars, as that they became not visible, and we knew thereby that a great king was born in Israel, and therefore we are come to worship him.
8 Then said Herod to them, Go and make diligent inquiry; and if ye find the child, bring me word again, that I may come and worship him also.
9 So the wise men went forth, and behold, the star which they saw in the east went before them, till it came and stood over the cave where the young child was with Mary his mother
10 Then they brought forth oat of their treasures, and offered unto him gold and frankincense, and myrrh.
11 And being warned in a dream by an angel, that they should not return to Herod through Judæa, they departed into their own country by another way.
There is a reason they 1) Left this out of the Bible
2) Made sure everyone had a Bible
I am glad that you wrote this piece because it needs to be said or maybe even shouted from the rooftops. But, having personal experience with this subject matter, and, the utter contempt most people have for it, I highly doubt many would listen. When I started my YT Channel in 2006 I brought up this subject on my channel and was eviscerated for sharing this topic. There was continual attack upon my person. At the time, I did not realize that there were people who actually made a living trolling channels such as mine. It does not matter anymore, though, because those who belong to Jesus are already counted.
I will probably reread your commentary on this subject as I was in a hurry ( as always ) and probably missed some golden nuggets.
Thanks, AT, for sharing such an enlightened perspective.
No. I deleted that one and have one that is more concerning what myself and others have been filming in the sky. This is also related to the Return of Jesus Christ. Everything is connected.
You said that you did not know what compelled you to write your commentary but I think we always know but are not wont to acknowledge; it's the Holy Spirit. We have been so conditioned to rely on our own ( or the social structure of hierarchy/"experts" ) wits and wisdom that we rarely give credit where credit is due.
Your piece was so well thought out and complete in understanding ( no one could have misunderstood what you were inferring ) that it felt inspirational. It is!
Thank you for being patient. We have a little farmette so have to tend to a lot of things plus a stomach virus. It took me a bit to get back to this but I think it so very important.
I think YT changed my name from Mourning Glory back to Jamie Santos. You won't find much there other than some videos that I made on the incoming planetary system and about 1k archived videos in my playlists.
** Edit **
I just remembered you may not know what I am talking about with reference to Divine Intervention. Have you read anything on Contactees/UFO contact? Well, in these contact the very same scenario unfolds as told in the Protevangelion Chapter XIII.
The suspension of time......whatever anyone was doing at that moment of contact all parties not invited to the experience are rendered motionless. Just as Joseph reported.
In the last 7 years I was led to read Zecheria Sitchin's books. I had never heard of him or the content of his books. I had heard of the Sumerians but only briefly in history books. We've been lied to about a lot of things. Too many to number. His books destroy 'their' lies with more truth than we can shake a stick at.
There is no dictionary, etymological or otherwise, and no Biblical concordance which will directly assist in acquiring an understanding of the Lord's Incarnation through the Holy Spirit and the Virgin Mary.
And no amount of creative interpolation will help in grasping that Mystery.
Vis a vis your substack, I'm obliged to add: "That's just my opinion", but there are hundreds of thousands worldwide who would agree with me.
Look past your easy characterization of space pilots in the Kosovo fresco.
If that monastery is still active, try your ideas out on its custodians -- they might be of some help in interpreting this masterpiece of Orthodox Iconography. Such is not Egyptian tomb painting, but is part of a tradition which lives today worldwide.
As you may have noticed, I wrote it in a rather lighthearted manner with impressions that a child might have after reading the account the first time. A child has a curious and inquisitive mind and is not afraid to give his impressions, or at least shouldn't be made to feel afraid. Jesus said of these are the kingdom of God.
The "little children" reference can be abused, and I have heard it used to defend childish irreverence before mysteries.
The child held by the Lord as he pronounced those words is considered by the Orthodox Church to have been "St. Ignatius the God Bearer". But to regard anyone -- as did St. Ignatius -- desiring martyrdom in the pagan coliseum as being of any assistance in matters today is to have something of a childlike awe or sensitivity unknown to most academic theologians.
So what in particular 'chard, got your hackles up in my essay? What particular perspectives do you seem to be afraid of? I think I mentioned that as a particular problem with a strictly orthodox view of Christianity...
You know.
Wonderful to see.
If I had time I would share with you an excerpt from a book I read last year but am pressed for time. Perhaps I can make it back here tomorrow and share.
That would be great thank you! I am still planning to narrate an audio for this and add it in.
Perhaps you've read Raymond Fowler's book, The Watchers II? If you did then I am sure you did not miss page 192 and 193 about The Protevangelion.
It absolutely makes clear that Mary and Joseph were both being helped and guided by extraterrestrials in preparation for the birth of Jesus. It is an account that I had never heard of other than in modern UFO/Contactee experiences.
If you would like I could share The Protevangelion 2-14 with you if you've not read the book.
I have not read that book Jamie and would be interested to see what it says.
I'm not too sure what inspired me to write about this. The gospel account is extremely curious in its own right. Evidently the artists who made the two paintings and the fresco had their own sources of inspiration or knowledge. I did find it humourous how forward the angel Gabriel was with Mary, and how unfamiliar or insensitive or...alien he was to how Mary might respond to his shocking fiat. I mean, you certainly couldn't call it a proposal.
I would love to see the pages you reference, perhaps you could send me a link to a source? Thank you!
CHAP. XIII.
1 Joseph seeks a Hebrew midwife, 2 perceives the fowls stopping in their flight, 3 the working people at their food not moving, 8 the sheep standing still, 9 the shepherd fixed and immoveable, 10 and kids with their mouths touching the water but not drinking.
AND leaving her and his sons in the cave, Joseph went forth to seek a Hebrew midwife in the village of Bethlehem.
2 But as I was going (said Joseph) I looked up into the air, and I saw the clouds astonished, and the fowls of the air stopping in the midst of their flight.
3 And I looked down towards the earth, and saw a table spread, and working people sitting around it, but their hands were upon the table, and they did not move to eat.
4 They who had meat in their mouths did not eat.
5 They who lifted their hands up to their heads did not draw them back:
6 And they who lifted them up to their mouths did not put anything in;
7 But all their faces were fixed upwards.
8 And I beheld the sheep dispersed, and yet the sheep stood still.
9 And the shepherd lifted up his hand to smite them, and his hand continued up.
10. And I looked unto a river, and saw the kids with their mouths close to the water, and touching it, but they did not drink.
CHAP. XIV.
1 Joseph finds a midwife. 10 A bright cloud overshadows the care. 11 A great light in the cave, gradually increases until the infant is born. 13 The midwife goes out, and tells Salome that she has seen a virgin bring forth. 17 Salome doubts it. 20 her hand withers, 22 she supplicates the Lord, 28 is cured, 30 but warned not to declare what she had seen.
THEN I beheld a woman coming down from the mountains, and she said to me, Where art thou going, O man?
2 And I said to her, I go to inquire for a Hebrew midwife.
3 She replied to me, Where is the woman that is to be delivered?
4 And I answered, In the cave, and she is betrothed to me.
5 Then said the midwife, Is she not thy wife?
6 Joseph answered, It is Mary, who was educated in the Holy of Holies, in the house of the Lord, and she fell to my lot, and is not my wife, but has conceived by the Holy Ghost.
7 The midwife said, Is this true?
8 He answered, Come and see.
9 And the midwife went along with him, and stood in the cave.
10 Then a bright cloud overshadowed the cave, and the midwife
p. 34
said, This day my soul is magnified, for mine eyes have seen surprising things, and salvation is brought forth to Israel.
11 But on a sudden the cloud became a great light in the cave, so that their eyes could not bear it.
12 But the light gradually decreased, until the infant appeared, and sucked the breast of his mother Mary.
13 Then the midwife cried out, and said, How glorious a day is this, wherein mine eyes have seen this extraordinary sight!
14 And the midwife went out from the cave, and Salome met her.
15 And the midwife said to her, Salome, Salome, I will tell you a most surprising thing which I saw,
16 A virgin hath brought forth, which is a thing contrary to nature.
17 To which Salome replied, As the Lord my God liveth, unless I receive particular proof of this matter, I will not believe that a virgin hath brought forth.
18 ¶ Then Salome went in, and the midwife said, Mary, shew thyself, for a great controversy is risen concerning thee.
19 And Salome received satisfaction.
20 But her hand was withered, and she groaned bitterly.
21 And said, Woe to me, because of mine iniquity; for I have tempted the living God, and my hand is ready to drop off.
22 Then Salome made her supplication to the Lord, and said, O God of my fathers, remember me, for I am of the seed of Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob.
23 Make me not a reproach among the children of Israel, but restore me sound to my parents.
24 For thou well knowest, O Lord, that I have performed many offices of charity in thy name, and have received my reward from thee.
25 Upon this an angel of the Lord stood by Salome, and said, The Lord God hath heard thy prayer, reach forth thy hand to the child, and carry him, and by that means thou shalt be restored.
26 Salome, filled with exceeding joy, went to the child, and said, I will touch him:
27 And she purposed to worship him, for she said, This is a great king which is born in Israel.
28 And straightway Salome was cured.
29 Then the midwife went out of the cave, being approved by God.
30 And lo! a voice came to Salome, Declare not the strange things which thou hast seen, till the child shall come to Jerusalem.
31 So Salome also departed, approved by God.
CHAP. XV.
1 Wise men come from the east. 3. Herod alarmed; 8 desires them if they find the child, to bring him word. 10 They visit the cave, and offer the child their treasure, 11 and being warned in a dream, do not return to Herod, but go home another way.
THEN Joseph was preparing to go away, because there arose a great disorder in Bethlehem by the coming of 1 some wise men from the east,
p. 35
2 Who said, Where is the king of the Jews born? For we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him.
3 When Herod heard this, he was exceedingly troubled, and sent messengers to the wise men, and to the priests, and inquired of them in the town-hall,
4 And said unto them, Where have you it written concerning Christ the king, or where should he be born?
5 Then they say unto him, In Bethlehem of Judæa; for thus it is written: And thou Bethlehem in the land of Judah, art not the least among the princes of Judah, for out of thee shall come a ruler, who shall rule my people Israel.
6 And having sent away the chief priests, he inquired of the men in the town-hall, and said unto them, What sign was it ye saw concerning the king that is born?
7 They answered him, We saw an extraordinary large star shining among the stars of heaven, and so out-shined all the other stars, as that they became not visible, and we knew thereby that a great king was born in Israel, and therefore we are come to worship him.
8 Then said Herod to them, Go and make diligent inquiry; and if ye find the child, bring me word again, that I may come and worship him also.
9 So the wise men went forth, and behold, the star which they saw in the east went before them, till it came and stood over the cave where the young child was with Mary his mother
10 Then they brought forth oat of their treasures, and offered unto him gold and frankincense, and myrrh.
11 And being warned in a dream by an angel, that they should not return to Herod through Judæa, they departed into their own country by another way.
AT, this is copied from this site ---------> https://sacred-texts.com/bib/lbob/lbob06.htm
There is a reason they 1) Left this out of the Bible
2) Made sure everyone had a Bible
I am glad that you wrote this piece because it needs to be said or maybe even shouted from the rooftops. But, having personal experience with this subject matter, and, the utter contempt most people have for it, I highly doubt many would listen. When I started my YT Channel in 2006 I brought up this subject on my channel and was eviscerated for sharing this topic. There was continual attack upon my person. At the time, I did not realize that there were people who actually made a living trolling channels such as mine. It does not matter anymore, though, because those who belong to Jesus are already counted.
I will probably reread your commentary on this subject as I was in a hurry ( as always ) and probably missed some golden nuggets.
Thanks, AT, for sharing such an enlightened perspective.
Thank you Jamie for taking the time and trouble of preparing and sending this to me. I will also study this more carefully and look at your reference.
Thank you as well for your comments!
Don't know about enlightened, but the whole story struck me as curious!
Do you still have your YouTube channel and if so what is it?
No. I deleted that one and have one that is more concerning what myself and others have been filming in the sky. This is also related to the Return of Jesus Christ. Everything is connected.
You said that you did not know what compelled you to write your commentary but I think we always know but are not wont to acknowledge; it's the Holy Spirit. We have been so conditioned to rely on our own ( or the social structure of hierarchy/"experts" ) wits and wisdom that we rarely give credit where credit is due.
Your piece was so well thought out and complete in understanding ( no one could have misunderstood what you were inferring ) that it felt inspirational. It is!
Thank you for being patient. We have a little farmette so have to tend to a lot of things plus a stomach virus. It took me a bit to get back to this but I think it so very important.
I think YT changed my name from Mourning Glory back to Jamie Santos. You won't find much there other than some videos that I made on the incoming planetary system and about 1k archived videos in my playlists.
** Edit **
I just remembered you may not know what I am talking about with reference to Divine Intervention. Have you read anything on Contactees/UFO contact? Well, in these contact the very same scenario unfolds as told in the Protevangelion Chapter XIII.
The suspension of time......whatever anyone was doing at that moment of contact all parties not invited to the experience are rendered motionless. Just as Joseph reported.
In the last 7 years I was led to read Zecheria Sitchin's books. I had never heard of him or the content of his books. I had heard of the Sumerians but only briefly in history books. We've been lied to about a lot of things. Too many to number. His books destroy 'their' lies with more truth than we can shake a stick at.
There is no dictionary, etymological or otherwise, and no Biblical concordance which will directly assist in acquiring an understanding of the Lord's Incarnation through the Holy Spirit and the Virgin Mary.
And no amount of creative interpolation will help in grasping that Mystery.
Vis a vis your substack, I'm obliged to add: "That's just my opinion", but there are hundreds of thousands worldwide who would agree with me.
Look past your easy characterization of space pilots in the Kosovo fresco.
If that monastery is still active, try your ideas out on its custodians -- they might be of some help in interpreting this masterpiece of Orthodox Iconography. Such is not Egyptian tomb painting, but is part of a tradition which lives today worldwide.
Failing that, you might inquire at website such as orthodoxtraditionalist.com.
As you may have noticed, I wrote it in a rather lighthearted manner with impressions that a child might have after reading the account the first time. A child has a curious and inquisitive mind and is not afraid to give his impressions, or at least shouldn't be made to feel afraid. Jesus said of these are the kingdom of God.
Well, alright; but the child's script didn't seem entirely ingenuous.
Oh?
The "little children" reference can be abused, and I have heard it used to defend childish irreverence before mysteries.
The child held by the Lord as he pronounced those words is considered by the Orthodox Church to have been "St. Ignatius the God Bearer". But to regard anyone -- as did St. Ignatius -- desiring martyrdom in the pagan coliseum as being of any assistance in matters today is to have something of a childlike awe or sensitivity unknown to most academic theologians.
So what in particular 'chard, got your hackles up in my essay? What particular perspectives do you seem to be afraid of? I think I mentioned that as a particular problem with a strictly orthodox view of Christianity...